A Conversation with Richard Julian (continued)

PM: On a different note, what do you think about the Hillary/Barack face-off?

RJ: Oh, man. I think it's turned into a real drag. It was fun for a while, and now it's just like a baseball game that's entered the 26th inning.

PM: [laughs] Yeah, right. Will somebody frickin' hit one out of here, please.

RJ: Yeah. You almost don't care if your team wins anymore. It seems to me like she's hanging on to something that's not really gonna be able to happen, and I don't believe that she's hanging on because she thinks that he's not qualified. She's even said that she would be the vice--she even has supported that idea a couple of times of the dual ticket. All I could think was, "Every day you're out there making the case this guy's not ready, but you would be his vice president?" It just seems like incredible double-talking.

PM: Yeah.

RJ: I never liked the Clintons anyway. I didn't like Bill Clinton, either. I voted for him. There was no other option, really.

PM: Right. You did what you had to.

RJ: Yeah, but I didn't like him. Frankly, the whole Lewinsky thing--I never thought he should be impeached. I thought that was some right-wing bullshit gone awry for sure. When the story first broke, and he didn't know that she had the dress, he tried to make her into some kind of crazy person. He denied it and then he had his people out there working a job on her, basically saying, "Yeah, we've been worried about her in the White House--she's almost stalking the president." I don't know if you remember all that.

PM: Oh, sure.

RJ: She could have killed herself or something, and she didn't even do anything. It's not even like she went to the press, like she deserved that kind of treatment. He was sleeping with this girl and then he turned on her like that. I just always thought that was--it was kind of a shame that the Republicans took it over and Ken Starr took it over in this really right-wing type of way, because I think they spoiled the real story, which was, this dude's a jerk. [laughs] Then he perjures himself over this shit. This guy's a jerk. You don't want your daughter with this guy, you know what I'm saying? But anyway, that's just my humble opinion. [laughs]

PM: Yeah, but I like it.

RJ: And Hillary, they just seem--I think Barack, up until recently, he ran a very dignified campaign, and it was kind of like Gandhi. It's that--when someone's beating you up, you just lay there and let the cameras film it, and it'll make them look like the asshole. He had that going for a while. Now he seems like he's been dragged into the mud. I don't know how long he'll keep it going, but it was fun to watch for a while--him sort of expose the Washington establishment just by doing nothing but being articulate and smart.

PM: Yeah. But I think it's gonna get nasty now.

RJ: I think he's gonna win it. Hopefully Indiana and North Carolina will be decisive for him, and the other super delegates at that juncture will just say, "We're doing this--deal with it." I'm kinda hoping in two weeks, we can move away from this.

PM: So this is the second CD now with Manhattan and the Blue Note label group, right?

RJ: Yeah.

PM: Has that been a good relationship? Is that a good home?

RJ: They're lovely people. I didn't have a label before, so I wouldn't know the difference between them and another label, but they seem to work hard at it and try to get it out there. The marketplace these days is insane for selling CDs. Nobody knows how the labels are gonna survive. I see it when I'm out there on the road, 'cause I'll pull into a market like Portland, Oregon, or Portland, Maine--some places I've hit already. I'll have a good crowd there and hardcore fans--people asking for tunes--and I start hearing people ask for tunes on the new record--play "Man in the Hole," play this or that. You go home, you look at the soundscan for that area, and you're not selling those records, and you're thinking--man, how do they know the tunes? [laughs] What's up with that? It's okay with me, because people just keep showing up and you just keep performing and kind of building it like that and having your life. I don't worry about it too much, but I worry about the label and what they're gonna do if they can't move physical product.

PM: Do you sell off the bandstand anymore, or no?

RJ: Yeah, absolutely. People buy them at the shows. They'll buy them there, so that's cool. I don't make a ton doing that, because I'm on a label, you know.

PM: Right. You're making a buck a record instead of ten.

RJ: When I went on the road with Norah the first year, I had Good Life, which is independent release, and I made a lot of money out there. It was great. There were some good times, baby.

PM: Yeah, right. Then you could make $1000 at a gig selling 100 CDs.

RJ: Exactly.

PM: Can you sell your previous CDs at your current gigs?

RJ: Oh, sure. They can't tell you what to do in that regard, although I wonder if the labels will move into that kind of model. Like some of these deals you're hearing about--these promoter deals like Madonna--I wonder if that's gonna be the wave of the money spending industry, because it's the only thing that really makes sense for them is to own all of you, and have their hands in all the pots. Put the money up front, make it worth your while, and then take home all the t-shirt money.

PM: And then they're coming for your publishing, yeah. Yeah, that's what I hate--when you hear them coming for artists' publishing and songwriter royalties and all kinds of stuff. But yeah, they're cutting whatever deal they can out there, the money lenders.

RJ: It's dangerous, though, for the artist to get that deeply involved with one entity. In the old model, you'd have a publisher, you'd have a label, then you'd have your manager, then you have your booking agent. You've got all of those things. One year, your label might just be into some other band or be too busy to pay attention to you, and you hope that those other people aren't, and that you can still keep your scene rolling from the interest of the other components of your posse. If you get inside some of these promotion deals that's so all-encompassing, if they decide to drop you like a hot potato, you'd be hard-pressed to know what to do next.

PM: Yeah, you're right all around. Before we sign off, I wanna know if you read anything good lately that I've gotta check out.

RJ: I've been reading a lot, actually. I read Steve Martin's autobiography. That was a fun little read. I just read this novella of Saul Bellow called Seize the Day. It was okay. I'm trying to think of what I've read that just really knocked me out lately. I don't know. I just picked up some Cormac McCarthy book. Not No Country for Old Men, but--I don't even know what I bought. I haven't started it yet.

PM: I like him, though. Most anything.

RJ: Yeah. I read All the Pretty Horses. He's got a brutal sense of life.

PM: I remember that was a beautiful book to listen to when I was crossing the country. I can't remember who was reading, but that was a particularly good audio book--All the Pretty Horses. [The excellent reader was Frank Muller.]

RJ: I keep Henry Miller with me all the time. I don't even leave on the road without some Miller.

PM: He's a staple.

RJ: Yeah, that's the bible. That's the thing where you just--if you're really feeling out of sorts, you just open up to any page. You just start going. It doesn't matter. It's not an obligation to have one of his books. You could read four pages of it and it makes your camel hump go up for a long time.

PM: [laughs] Well, it's a pleasure always, Richard, to talk with you. I think more than ever, this record shows who you really are in this kind of fragmented, fractured scene. For lack of a better phrase, you're the funny Bob Dylan. You're the urbane Lyle Lovett. I really think that when the smoke clears, that you are the dude.

RJ: Well thanks, man. Let's hope more people get to hear the record and just keep going out there. I think I'll be in Nashville early July. I don't know that it's firmed up, but it's on the calendar.

PM: Great. Where will you be playing this time?

RJ: I think at the Bluebird, actually.

PM: I've been getting up to the city a little bit lately. I've got a funeral in Tenafly this weekend, but I come back quick. I'll call you when I'm up next. Let's see if we can grab a coffee.

RJ: Sounds good. It's good to hear from you, Frank.

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