A Conversation with Johnsmith (continued)

PM: And I think it's true of you, to the extent that I know you as a friend, that more so than some people, you really base a lot of your mission here on the relationships that you have in this world.

JS: Yeah.

PM: I think a lot of singer/songwriters and artist people are so megalomaniacal that their chops in forming relationships are limited. But I think yours are really unlimited in that way, because you're not obsessed with yourself, and you're a people person. And I think your mission is people-driven as much as it's song-driven.

JS: Well, it's true. It's like this new record, I have some phenomenal players, a couple people that are heroes to me, Darrel Scott, Tim O'Brien. And they're not people that I went after to like get hired guns, but people that I've met, and that I've become really good friends with. And they both would say a lot of nice things about me musically, if you asked them, probably, but underneath that, we connected on a different level--just friends. I mean, they didn't feel like I was out to gherm them, or whatever you want to call that.

PM: Or use them.

JS: Or use, or whatever you call that.

PM: Yeah.

JS: I'm trying to say this in a humbling way, I'm just not at that level. I just think Tim and Darrel are absolutely--

PM: Top of their game.

JS: But they're people like you and me. It's all about relationships and friendships and stuff. So that's where that comes from.

PM: So before we talk about how that record got made, how did you know those guys? Where did you meet them?

JS: Well, somebody introduced me real briefly to Darrell at the Telluride Festival years ago. And I actually saw him--there was kind of a Newgrass Revival reunion. And it was Bela and Sam Bush and John Cowan, and no Pat Flynn. They just picked up a guy to play guitar. It was Darrell Scott. And I was like, holy moly, that guy is one wicked animal.

PM: He's unbelievable.

JS: It was incredible. So anyway, I just met him. And I think he had one of his kids with him. And he was sweet and nice, and I remembered that. Then some years went by and we bumped into each other in Nashville during my thing there. And that was just for a second, "Yeah, I remember you, I remember you." That was it. And then maybe four or five years ago there was this Mountain Stage radio program, sponsored a festival called the Mountain Stage New Song Festival. And the first year I got hired, and so did Darrell. And the very first night Darrell and I and another guy who'd written a lot of big songs--I can't remember the other two people. But Darrel and I sat next to each other in the round, and we just hit it off. Darrel really played on my songs and sang them. And neither one of us knew many people, so we just kind of bonded. We rented some bikes. Actually, one day we kind of borrowed Jimmie Dales' bikes off their big tour bus before they got up and went on this long bike ride. Very fun. And we just kind of bared our souls to each other, no music talk kind of stuff.

PM: Right. Two guys.

JS: Yeah. And I met him. And then the next year when Darrell and I both got invited back, Tim O'Brien was there. And there's a round with me and Tim and Darrel on the main stage. And I'm trying to be this humble low guy on the totem pole and sit over on the side. And Tim sits next to me. And I'm, oh, my God. I'm a really big fan, but I always kind of think he's kind of a--not shy, but know what I mean?

PM: A little aloof?

JS: Yeah. I don't know if it's even aloof. It's just guarded, at least that's what I was thinking. You know what I mean? Anyway, which was all stupid. As soon as we start singing he's all over my songs and singing. And we just hit it off at the end, very nice. Same thing happens, I end up hanging out with him most of the weekend. His son's with him, and we go eat at some friends of his' house. He takes me to the airport. Just real stuff, without much music other than that little bit of sharing. But in some way my music did get me there. We did sit on that stage together and swap songs, and maybe there was a little bit of a litmus test going on there--

PM: Sure.

JS: But I think they felt my heart in my songs, or something, like I feel in theirs.

PM: Hey, the songs are good, man.

JS: So anyway, that's kind of how those two connections were made.

[see our interviews with Darrell Scott and Tim O'Brien]

PM: And so how, when it came time to make a record, how did you pull it together and who was at the board, and all that?

JS: Well, I made a record two years ago, before this one, in Austin, Texas, with Lloyd Maines and Paul Pearcy, and Glenn Fukunaga, they're great guys. But I had this friendship with Darrell by then. And so after I did all my guitar vocals and rhythm tracks live, I was on the road, and I stopped in Nashville. And Darrel put some vocals--scary--you know, baritone guitar and dobro stuff, and really good.

PM: Wow.

JS: So then the next time Darrel was like, "Next time you make a record, talk to me."

PM: [laughs] That's how the real guys are. "No, don't bring me tracks, man. I want to cut it live."

JS: Yeah, so that's what we did. He hooked me up with Miles Wilkinson.

PM: A great guy.

JS: So I went out to Miles' little farmhouse, and I tracked with Darrell and Kenny Malone for two days.

PM: A prince.

JS: Yeah, the three of us; no headphones, no click track.

PM: And no bass player.

JS: And no bass player. We just, one, two, three, go. I had gotten together with Kenny the day before just to meet him. And being a solo songwriter that goes out there every night by myself, I love people jamming--I love jamming. I mean, I really am a band guy at heart. But most of us solo guys, our timing is all over the map, our songs really breathe, in a certain way, good and bad.

PM: Only the good guys know that, by the way.

JS: But you know what I mean? Sometimes when I do get together with a percussionist, it gets a little scary about who's driving the car here, sort of. And so I got together with Kenny, who I'd heard a lot, and really liked him. We hit it off, but just kind of--you know, what kind of beats per minute zone are we in here? What kind of a drum do we use? Do we do use djembe?

PM: Yeah, what's the feel.

JS: Do we use a snare and brushes? What's the feel. We just made some notes, and I felt good. So then the next day we just start going, man. And then there's a number of songs that were just me and my guitar. But anyway, we did that. And then Byron House came in and--

PM: One of my favorites.

JS: He did the upright bass stuff, I don't know, about six to eight tracks--I don't know the numbers exactly--perfect--bowed bass on one song, really nice. And then the next day Tim O'Brien, who's just a hoot, telling jokes, and just singing his butt off and playing mandolin and bouzouki and violin.

PM: Does he sing real high? What does Tim do?

JS: He sings his ass off high with me. I'm already kind of a high singer. It was really fun, too. He's agreed to come and do some stuff on the record. One day, I'm like, well, jeez, he's going to come in after the fact on this one song, because I really do want to have bass on it, and have Kenny do other things. So I guess I got to track that first--trying to figure out that. Well, I better know what key it's going to be in. So I literally called up Tim on the telephone, set the phone down on my table, and sing a little bit over the phone to him. "What do you think about that key, Tim?" I picked the phone back up, he's like, "It's perfect."

[laughter]

JS: So he really hit some sky-high harmonies on a couple things, yeah. Then I had guys like John Mock come in and do a little of the Irish thing. I had a couple songs that--one song is kind of an end of the night farewell to friends kind of a song that me and Tim and Andrea Zonn sing together.

PM: Oh, wow.

JS: Very sweet, very sweet.

PM: One of Nashville's angels.

JS: She is. Here's how graceful, graced, or blessed, or whatever you want to call it my record was: She was my first pick for violin. I love the violin stuff. I love it. And so I call her. And I've worked with her in sessions, demo sessions. She's an angel. And I call her, and she's like, "Oh, John, I'd like to, but I'm on the James Taylor tour." I go, "Okay, thanks anyway." She's like, "Sorry." But then it works out that I get Stuart Duncan. Stuart Duncan is like--

PM: That's Nashville. "I couldn't get Andrea Zonn, I got Stuart Duncan."

JS: Who Darrel and Tim helped me get. I mean, maybe Stuart would have done it for the money, I don't know, it depends. But when I told him those guys had given me the name, then I--

PM: Yeah, you maybe got to know somebody to get Stuart.

JS: There's a little name-dropping that has to go on every time.

[laughter]

JS: And Stuart was phenomenal. But then at the end of the project, Andrea calls when she gets back, says, "I'm just checking on your project." I said, "Unbelievable. I got a couple things I really need a singer on. And I got a song that a viola would be like so cool." And she says, "I'm there."   continue

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