A Conversation with Jonatha Brooke (continued)

PM: So like I was saying, you're definitely one of the few female singer/songwriters who wrote and is writing the book on going your own way in this very difficult business.

JB: Oh, my God, it's not getting any easier, is it?

PM: No. It's getting harder, if anything.

JB: Yep.

PM: Do you have anything to share about where you think this business is at, or where it's going? You have any feelings about that?

JB: I have a lot of feelings, and it's very confusing--It's hard to say where it's going. It's harder than ever.

PM: Isn't that the thing? Everybody you talk to says, "Well, I just don't know, man." Nobody knows.

JB: Nobody knows. And the biggest question on everyone's list is like, how are we going to sell records? How are we going to keep selling records when they're basically out there for free? And the industry in general hasn't done itself any favors in trying to maintain the cache and the value of music.

PM: Right.

JB: They're discounting like crazy. Just because people whine and kvetch about how much a CD costs, they've completely kowtowed to that mentality of like, "Well, music should be free, so we're going to just keep slashing and burning." And I think the whole perception of music has suffered. Where it used to be, "Oh, my God, I have to get this record, and I don't care what it costs, because it's that artist that I love, and I want to hear every word, I want to read the book, I want to see the back of the album cover, I want to know who did what." And I think that we have to figure out a way, collectively, to re-establish the value of art. I mean, this is art that we sweat, bleed and suffer over. And it costs a bunch, still, I mean, even if you're doing it on your laptop, okay? That's not how I do it. But it's expensive to make a great record. Okay, it's less than it used to be. But how do you put the cat back into the bag and make people say, "Wow, this is a valuable thing, and I'm willing to pay for it. I'm not going to steal it." You don't steal a leather jacket from a store. I don't know. It's just a weird conundrum.

PM: Yeah. I refuse to shut up about it, too, that I keep talking about it in the 'zine, that stealing is stealing, people. Come on. It's so basic.

JB: Hello, hello.

PM: You don't do it anywhere else, don't do it here.

JB: Exactly. And this is Pat's story, but I'm going to steal it for your benefit.

PM: Good.

JB: But it's really true, you don't blink about going to a movie, movie tickets are twelve bucks a piece now in New York City at least. Then you spend another six bucks on a thing of popcorn, right? And then maybe another five on your drinks. I mean, you're talking two people in the movies, you might be out fifty bucks--

PM: Easily.

JB: --for an hour and a half that's gone.

PM: And I hope it was a good movie.

JB: Yeah, and hope it was a good movie, because you're not getting your money back. But people kick and scream about spending thirteen bucks on a CD that they'll have forever, that you also can return if anything about it displeases you. And where's the disconnect? Where do people get off bitching about that and they would never bitch about like seeing a shitty movie and having spent your fifty bucks?

PM: Well, if it was as easy to download a movie as it was to download a record--[It's easy enough, but it's a more high-tech hack.]

JB: Exactly.

PM: --they'd be having a bigger problem than they are.

JB: Yes. Music is a much more steal-able format.

PM: But it will come.

JB: But the movie industry has been much more active about educating the public about piracy. And I think the music industry has just really missed the boat in terms of a consistent campaign of, "Hey, this is stealing, and this is how it affects people." I don't know if you saw--they had some trailers a while ago about piracy in movies. And they showed the key grip and the dolly guy and the cater dude.

PM: They're really good.

JB: "If you steal our movie, we're out of work."

PM: Right. They really made sense, they brought it home.

JB: They did. And I don't think the music industry did at all a successful job of that kind of education.

PM: I was writing some anti-piracy stuff for China for my brother in New York, and some of my stuff was all about musicians needing to come out of their bags about, "Don't you understand what's involved here? Here's my producer, here's my wife, here's my bass player. Let us talk to you about what happens."

JB: It's true. And I've been really vocal about it. And I've been at all these conferences, and I've been on panels. And it just seems like if you're me, you don't get the press, and it doesn't get out there. If you're Metallica or Britney Spears, and you're trying to make waves about it, people are just going "Aw, shut the hell up. You're loaded. What do you have to worry about?" So then it kind of kills the cause.

PM: That's a point well taken.

JB: But someone like me, mid-level, I'm not going to--who cares what I say, although 99.9 percent of all musicians are more in my kind of situation--

PM: At best.

JB: --we're just trying to piece it together every month.

PM: Absolutely.

JB: But we're not getting the press, because we're not sensational, or we're not going to sell the magazines.

PM: I appreciate all that, because I think people need to read that, and they need to hear it from artists.

JB: They do. And it for me, okay, these two new records that I'm very proud of--I couldn't be more excited about them--but every day, Pat and I are sitting here like, "How are we going to hire a publicist?"

PM: Yeah, because they're expensive...

JB: Okay. We'll just figure it out. We always do. So we're going to hire a publicist, and worry about it at the end of the month. But how are we going to get airplay? Because these records deserve to be heard.

PM: Right.

JB: But if I ain't selling them, if I got nothing coming in to offset my very real expenses--it's not like I'm out shopping all day. I'm trying to run a business.

PM: Yeah, people don't understand what publicity and promotion cost. I mean, it's out there.

JB: Yeah. And they think, "Oh, you're a rock star, or you're a musician, you must be all set."

PM: Yeah, you're good.

JB: But it's a small business.

PM: Nothing but, yeah.

Do you find time or make time to read? You reading anything lately that turned you on?

JB: I just read--oh, shoot, what was it called? Special Topics in Calamity Physics, Marisha Pessl.

PM: That's funny.

JB: It's a novel.

PM: Yeah, good; because I was thinking, wow, that's a branch of science I'm not familiar with.

JB: And I also just read The Sea, the John Banville book. I thought that was pretty awesome. I'm working on What is the What?, the new Dave Eggers one.

PM: Right. Absolutely.

JB: It's been slow going so far, but I'm hoping it's going to pick up.

PM: Well, thanks, I'm sure they're all going to pick up. I haven't read any of those, so I'm going to check them out.

JB: I'm a huge Ian McEwan fan, so Saturday just fuckin' rocked, I thought. Yeah.

PM: Where in the world do you guys like to go to get away from it all?

JB: South of France!

PM: That was quick.

JB: We honeymooned there.

PM: You're lucky to have that partnership. That's a wonderful thing.

JB: It's pretty cool.

PM: And you've been very generous with your time this morning.

JB: Are you kidding? It's great to talk to you.

PM: I knew you'd be a really fascinating artist, and certainly you are.

JB: [laughs] Flattery.

PM: Got me here, didn't it?

JB: It shouldn't be underrated.

PM: Thanks, Jonatha. You're a really cool person. I appreciate your time.

JB: Likewise, Frank, thank you.

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