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A Conversation with Sarah Hawker (continued)
PM: On this latest record, you very adeptly pulled Rayna Gellert into the mix.
SH: Oh, man!
PM: How did that happen? Speaking of Abigail Washburn, I mean. [Rayna and Abigail both play in the all-female old-time group Uncle Earl.]
SH: Yeah, we'd all be friends because we all traveled in that same circle of hanging out and playing and stuff. And so I had known all those Uncle Earl girls, and especially Rayna. And we just, at some point, approached her about doing it, because she had loved the second CD, and was really just so supportive about it. So we asked her if she wouldn't like to do this with us, and she said she would. And it was amazing, because I swear to God, the songs that she recorded, I think she practiced them once before she played them.
PM: Sometimes that's the best.
SH: Yeah. And that's what we wanted. But she just knew. She just got it, the sympathetic tones and--I mean, it was just beautiful. She's such a pleasure to work with. And her tone is so gorgeous.
PM: And just the approach she took to the tunes, the long bowing--
SH: Exactly, exactly.
PM: Wow, that's so smart.
SH: And the fact that she can hold her arms up that long and that slow--
[laughter]
PM: There are a number of songs in three-quarter time on this last record. But I really like two of the country-type waltzes you wrote for this record, "Romans" and "Tonight You're Going To Lose Me."
SH: Oh, thanks.
PM: In fact, they both would really sound good with a country band and a steel guitar.
SH: Uh-huh.
PM: Have you ever heard them or played them like that?
SH: Well, not those particular ones. But when I was in the city, I did have a honky-tonk band.
PM: You did?
SH: Well, we were a really half-assed honky-tonk band. It was really fun. It was sort of like an early Sun sound. Like two wheels on the ground, a stand-up bass, and me on acoustic, and someone playing just amazing electric guitar.
PM: And where were you playing?
SH: Just around the City.
PM: The Living Room?
SH: No, not even that. No, it was like bars.
PM: The Rodeo Bar, or not even?
SH: Not even. We didn't even get that far. I mean, literally, I think we played out like three times.
PM: Right, you played around the corner, wherever that was.
SH: Yeah. It was more like, "Hey, let's go to Brooklyn and play at--" I can't even remember the name of the place. But there was a place out there that we played a couple times.
PM: Right.
SH: So we just wailed on it.
PM: So you've heard your songs that way, with a country band.
SH: Yeah.
PM: And did you have a steel guitar in that honky-tonk band?
SH: No. He was playing like a real '50s, heavy string kind of sound.
PM: Right. A lot of tremolo and--
SH: Yeah. So I just left it to him.
PM: Lyrically, the song "Romans" addresses the "self-righteous, not being able to hide their pride in angels' wings."
SH: Uh-huh.
PM: What prompted that song, if I may ask?
SH: The current state of affairs in the world, basically. It was just like one of those things--I mean, God knows what piece of news I just read or if it was more an amalgamation. But it's just the general rigidness of righteousness that's going on in so many--I mean, obviously our current administration, and the trends here as well in other places, on all different sides of the divide of what your beliefs are. It's just the rigidity of righteousness and the lack of humility.
PM: I hear ya.
How about those incredible banjos that you and Debra both play? What are they, and where did you find them, and how do you mic them up live and in the studio?
SH: Well, Debra can you tell you more about it. [We didn't get to talk to Debra Clifford for this piece, but we'll feature her in the future video interview with the Sisters.] But she plays a Kevin Enoch fretless banjo. He makes beautiful banjos. And she just got this one. And we both use these Nyle gut strings, which is like a fake gut, because it stays in tune. I believe they're made in Italy. I mean, I think they're Italian. I can't even remember. Again, that's something Debra is better with than I am.
PM: She's more of a gearhead.
SH: Uh-huh, way more.
PM: An acoustic gearhead, right.
SH: Yes. [laughs] So we both use those. And mine is an old turn-of-the-century ladies banjo, with a big fat pot and a little neck. And it's just a funky old thing.
PM: Wow. And you take those precious things on the road?
SH: Yeah.
PM: You have monster cases for them, or what?
SH: Yeah, we have some flight cases, and what we try to do is finagle our way onto the airplane. We've got all kinds of like poses and ways to carry things. And I mean, it's like down to a science.
PM: And it's such a hassle, yeah.
SH: Oh, it's a nightmare.
PM: So I'm really going to let you go in a minute, but I must ask if there's anything you've read lately that turned you on, or turned you around?
SH: Hmm, what was the most recent thing? Well, I mean, it doesn't have to do with anything, but the most recent thing that I've been reading that I love is going to sound completely dorky, but the Lyndon Johnson Biography series.
PM: I've heard it's fantastic, actually.
SH: Oh, my God, Robert Caro, he is unbelievable. Actually, I started on the second one, and now I've gone back to the first. And it's just amazing how he can put you there in the whole history of the time of West Texas, and what Johnson went through, and coming to Washington, and the Great Depression, and all this stuff. It's just unbelievable.
PM: And lastly--I always am compelled to ask--are what you'd call a spiritual person?
SH: Yeah, absolutely.
PM: Any more on that, any certain kinds of orientation, or?
SH: No. I think lately the word has come to me, an "energetic liver."
[laughter]
SH: And that's the best thing I can say. I guess I just am always trying to bring it back into being in balance and keeping priorities straight. I don't mean this in a grand way, but more just going back to the thing about my grandfather, it's sort of like you have to do what you're here to do. And nobody has to like it, it's okay. But this is what I'm supposed to be doing, and I just stick with that. And something in my experience and the things that I've gone through can bring some good in the world. And that's really it. I mean, you have this chance at consciousness [laughs] for a minute, so run with it.
PM: Right. And that, after all, is the name of the game.
SH: Yes. You're not a tree, so go for it.
PM: [laughs] Well, I love what you're doing. I love your music, and it's wonderful to catch up with you tonight in this way.
SH: Thanks. It was a real pleasure to talk to you. And I'm so glad that you like the music. Well, you have a really good night, and let's stay in touch.
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our review of Follow Me Down chad crumm's studio
The Lonesome Sisters live on the radio rileybaugus.com
Our special thanks to Maria Camillo for her many fine pictures of the Lonesome Sisters. To see some more of her photos (and to find out about her other life as Booking Agent Supreme), visit mcbooking.com.
